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Kristin K.PRO
Kristin K. Sendmail

How to Train for a First Ultra

posted almost 4 years ago | Report

My brother has been doing these crazy for a few years now. I'd like to try out a 50 mile race. Any ideas on a good race to start with. And how do I take my training to the next level. I've done a ton of marathons, but never anything more than that...

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  • Kelly K.PRO
    Kelly K. Sendmail

    You should look into the voyageur 50m, or kettle moraine 100km, or the superior 50m. All are on some pretty great local trails.

    For training, get on those trails and hit the miles. I usually try to run a 15-20 miler each week. With a 30-50 mile peak run a month before the race, and then throttle back the miles to a taper.

    posted almost 4 years ago | Report

  • Kristin K.PRO
    Kristin K. Sendmail
    in reply to what Kelly K. said:You should look into the voyageur 50m, or kettle moraine 100km, or the superior 50m. All are on some pretty great local trails. For training, get on those trails and hit the miles. I usually try to run a 15-20 miler each week. With a 30-50 mile p... read more

    Sounds like a plan...thanks!

    posted almost 4 years ago | Report

  • Leslie G.
    Leslie G. Sendmail

    I'm considering the AR 50 in April. I just finished my first marathon two weeks ago (so the 50 mile race will be 4 months after the marathon). Should I just try to get back up to 50 miles per week and include some long runs? Should my long runs top out at 30, or should I go longer? Any ideas about doubles or back to back long run days? Any input would be so appreciated. THANKS!!!

    posted about 3 years ago | Report

  • Devin B.
    Devin B. Sendmail

    Well... $60 says I'm doing the Rocky Raccoon 50 on 2/7. That's because I just paid my entry fee today. I'm excited and nervous about it. Mostly excited :)

    posted about 3 years ago | Report

  • Scott R.
    Scott R. Sendmail

    I finished my 1st 50 miler in Vermont last September. It was an amazing experience and I am planning on doing it again next year.

    First I would say pick a 50 miler that is mostly on dirt (trails, logging roads, etc). And then train on those conditions (which can be hard in winter depending on where you live). I have trained for 4 marathons, and during two of them I have gotten injured (knee). I know I had the stamina and guts in me to do 50 miles, but I was concerned about increasing the mileage so much in order to tackle in Ultra. The truth is because I did almost all of my runs on trails, I avoided injury. Softer surface really helps! Also many trails tend to be hilly, so you are working your quads more and your legs become stronger all around - again avoiding injury.

    Point is DO IT!!! You can and you will!!

    I do have some training tips as well if anyone is interested. How far to go, back to back long runs (lost weekends), going from marathon to ultra's, etc.

    run long.

    posted about 3 years ago | Report

  • Jon L.
    Jon L. Sendmail

    Please don't forget to prepare mentally. You just have to resolve in your mind that no matter what, you will finish the race. This is very important in the last few miles during the race. Anything less than 100% mental resolution will not cut it.

    Above all, enjoy the experience. I wish the best.

    posted about 3 years ago | Report

  • Jeff N.
    Jeff N. Sendmail

    Hey Scott ... I'm interested in the advice. I'm going to train for a marathon PR this year at the Marine Corps, but am looking to do the Mountain Masochist 50 miler in VA in 2010. Can never start planning to early ;-) Thanks ...

    posted about 3 years ago | Report

  • Scott R.
    Scott R. Sendmail
    in reply to what Jeff N. said:Hey Scott ... I'm interested in the advice. I'm going to train for a marathon PR this year at the Marine Corps, but am looking to do the Mountain Masochist 50 miler in VA in 2010. Can never start planning to early ;-) Thanks ...

    Hi Jeffrey - Great news about your PR attempt and plans for the MM 50. Sounds like a lot of great goals.

    I really enjoyed training for the VT 50. More so then training for marathons. This was partly because the training was more flexible. Less speed work outs and tempos. It's more about getting outside and enjoying the trails - not concerning yourself of pace. This will come as a relief b/c you are likely all about the watch right now training for a PR.

    In summary I ran 5 days a week, and it went something like this:
    Monday: Rest
    Tuesday: 8-11
    Wednesday: 5-6
    Thursday: 8
    Friday: Rest
    Saturday: 8 - 12
    Sunday: 25 - 32

    This is basically how it went for the bulk of my training, of course throwing in ramp up time as well as some down weeks. Down weeks means a 20 mile long run. Sounds long, but after a few 30+ mile runs it's like you are just going out for a quicky. I did 30+ 3 times during my training. I wanted to do it 4 times, and in hindsight I think it would have helped.

    The hardest part is finding the time. I have two very young kids, in fact my youngest was just a few months old when I trained for this. So this meant very early mornings (we are talking 3:30 am). The second hardest thing, coming from running reasonably fast marathons, is convincing yourself that walking is okay. This is key for your 30+ training runs. I walked the steep hills during my long runs only. But walking is important, your legs thank you around mile 28. I struggled with this because I thought you always had to run. I like to think of these hill walks a speed hiking.

    I can send you my rough training plan, just send me your email address. mine is scott@schremick.com.

    I am currently training for Boston. So back to the track and tread for some speed workouts. Can't wait to get back on the dirt trails where I don't need to be a slave to my watch!

    Hope this helps a bit.
    Cheers!

    posted about 3 years ago | Report

  • Jeff N.
    Jeff N. Sendmail
    in reply to what Scott R. said:Hi Jeffrey - Great news about your PR attempt and plans for the MM 50. Sounds like a lot of great goals. I really enjoyed training for the VT 50. More so then training for marathons. This was partly because the training was more flexible. Less s... read more

    Scott, thanks for advice, certainly appreciate it. Would love to see the training plan as well as your Boston training plan. Is this your first Boston? I have a couple of 1/2's coming up before I start putting in serious mileage for the MC.

    Finding the time will probably be the hardest part. I had heard about walking the hills so you don't trash your quads - it will be fun to just get out there and run.

    My email address is normanjr@triad.rr.com.

    Appreciate it!
    Jeff

    posted about 3 years ago | edited about 3 years ago | Report

  • Paul S.
    Paul S. Sendmail
    in reply to what Jeff N. said:Scott, thanks for advice, certainly appreciate it. Would love to see the training plan as well as your Boston training plan. Is this your first Boston? I have a couple of 1/2's coming up before I start putting in serious mileage for the MC. F... read more

    Hey Jeffrey,

    Check out this website--http://www.scrunners.org/ultrasch.php

    I did a 50 miler, Ice Age 50 in Wisconsin (beautiful weather there in May) this last May and the following schedule was absolutely perfect. Ended up doing close to a marathon for almost 10 weeks. Doing the runs on trails for sure helps--must do as otherwise to much pounding on the pavement. Biggest thing is putting in the miles no matter what. The time it takes to do the runs is not so important; ie. doing 8-9 minute pace is fine for the long runs. Like Scott said it becomes automatic after a few weeks in terms of the big runs. Yes, as Scott, also said the schedule is more flexible which is sweet versus the 1/2 marathons which have the interval training/speed component. If you follow this schedule to a 'T' I really do not believe you need to do more than the 1 31 miler. Don't believe you need to do that many 30+milers; this schedule has a 28 miler, etc. I easily handled the 50; finished the last 10 miles at a 8 minute pace. First 40 was quite a bit slower, but there were a ton of switchbacks, and a ton of hills--walked all hills up and down (or at a very slow pace 10+ minute miles on the hills); yes, you can do it quicker, but no one needs so much pounding that it puts you under the knife of a PT surgeon.
    http://www.scrunners.org/ultrasch.php

    posted about 3 years ago | Report

  • Tara B.
    Tara B. Sendmail

    I can't believe I just stumbled upon this group! I am doing a 70k ultra (my first) in Nashville on 10/17/09. I am going to look at the schedule you posted, Paul; any other advice would be greatly appreciated as well!

    Has anyone seen this schedule: http://www.halhigdon.com/ultramarathon/m1.html

    What do you all think of that one?? I'll be coming off a marathon 5/3/09, and then am actually looking forward to slowing the pace a bit while training for the 70k. The first part of this schedule is not too terribly different than what I do now - the hard part for me will be getting long runs in on both Saturday AND Sunday, but that's ok!

    My good friend, who is 53, will be doing the ultra with me...our goal is just to finish, preferably sometime before the 12 hour cutoff - ha!! I turn 40 twelve days after the ultra, so I consider these marathons and the ultra my version of a mid-life crisis. :-)

    posted almost 3 years ago | Report

  • Paul S.
    Paul S. Sendmail

    Hey Tara, I'm with you on the 40 year old crisis as I am less than 2 months from that and probably part of the reason I did my 50 mile back in May. I quickly looked at higdon's calendar and honestly think the schedule I followed is better organized--note, as you go to this website--chose 50 mile over 50K. http://www.scrunners.org/ultrasch.php as I believe you really have to put in these miles--focus should be on putting in the miles no matter how long it takes you--no rush to finish each 'marathon' weekend on a 4 hour pace. Yes, putting in the miles is hard to do but I trained myself (not being a morning person) to start running before the rest of the family was even close to waking up. Plus, as it gets warmer you'll definitely want to do early morning. It was insane going over to Salem Lake and doing the course 4+times. I also just wanted to finish under the 12 hour mark and did it in 10:12. Yes other passed me but their PT surgeons will love them later on. Walked all hills up and down. Recommend using Ultra powder drink for training along with s-caps for electrolytes.

    posted almost 3 years ago | Report

  • Jamie H.
    Jamie H. Sendmail
    in reply to what Paul S. said:Hey Tara, I'm with you on the 40 year old crisis as I am less than 2 months from that and probably part of the reason I did my 50 mile back in May. I quickly looked at higdon's calendar and honestly think the schedule I followed is better organi... read more

    Thanks for that link Paul. It's an interesting strategy.

    posted almost 3 years ago | Report

  • Tara B.
    Tara B. Sendmail
    in reply to what Paul S. said:Hey Tara, I'm with you on the 40 year old crisis as I am less than 2 months from that and probably part of the reason I did my 50 mile back in May. I quickly looked at higdon's calendar and honestly think the schedule I followed is better organi... read more

    Thanks, Paul! I compared both schedules as well, and definitely like yours better - it actually seems more manageable. It's great because it starts my training the week of June 15th, so I have a little time between the May marathon and ultra training.

    You think running around Salem Lake 4 times is crazy - I'll be doing quite a bit of my training in Florida in the most hot and humid months of summer. I travel there for work once a month, and my friend who is doing the ultra is there as well, so she and I will train there when I'm in town, then she will travel here once or twice. We are going to try to hit the New River Trail at some point in the summer...did 30 miles up there as part of training for my first marathon last November. Great trail.

    Thanks again for the advice; it's nice to find someone local who has experience with this!

    What brand of Ultra powder drink? I'm a fan of Hammer Nutrition products, but really just want something that's going to get me through without bonking!

    posted almost 3 years ago | Report

  • Paul S.
    Paul S. Sendmail
    in reply to what Tara B. said:Thanks, Paul! I compared both schedules as well, and definitely like yours better - it actually seems more manageable. It's great because it starts my training the week of June 15th, so I have a little time between the May marathon and ultra tra... read more

    That's funny. I'm a fan of Hammer products as well. Weird. I've used(still use as I had a ton left over) of the Succeed powder as it is extremely easy on the stomach--designed by an ultra runner. Also the s-caps (1-2 an hour--depending on the heat). The following website will give you more details on the products: http://www.ultrunr.com/index.html plus this website has a ton of other ultra-training tidbits and links to even more on ultra-traing.
    In terms of Hammer, I've used the whey-protein isolate as a recovery drink for interval and long-distance recovery. Plus, I absolutely love the expresso gels.

    Also, I think higdon's training had you doing interval training--speaking from experience--if you put in the miles alone you won't need to concern yourself with speedwork if you just want to finish. This race will be 'easy' Just don't push it beyond what it recommends. In fact, my running buddy up in Wisconsin and I, picked up the pace after the 1st 40miles and had an 8 minute pace the last 10. Negative splits are everything. You want to keep a reserve like this as you never know how the run is going to go; ie. weather, blisters (ducttape is your friend), etc.

    posted almost 3 years ago | Report

  • Paul S.
    Paul S. Sendmail
    in reply to what Jamie H. said:Thanks for that link Paul. It's an interesting strategy.

    No problemo. Hope it helped or at least entertained.

    posted almost 3 years ago | Report

  • Marc K.
    Marc K. Sendmail

    @Tara, I'll also attempting the Nashville Ultra as my first 50 mile! I'm currently basing my training off of Hal's program as well.

    @Paul, That plan looks very interesting and I'll be comparing it to my current one and probably be making some edits. Thanks for the link!

    posted almost 3 years ago | Report

  • Paul S.
    Paul S. Sendmail
    in reply to what Marc K. said:@Tara, I'll also attempting the Nashville Ultra as my first 50 mile! I'm currently basing my training off of Hal's program as well. @Paul, That plan looks very interesting and I'll be comparing it to my current one and probably be making some ed... read more

    No worries. I must tell you it really really was manageable as it incorporated a good amount of rest. My current program from Hal Higdon Advanced II is wicked compared to that (lots of speedwork) one I recommended--especially as Hal's had me up to close to 50 miles a week just for the marathon. If you put in every single mile they recommend from the Santa C. schedule--you'll definitely be good to go!

    posted almost 3 years ago | Report

  • Bradley J.
    Bradley J. Sendmail

    Join a group of crazy ultra marathon runners. Clubfatass.com for example. I’ve been a member for 4 years and I usually do the New Years Day 50k plus a few other events through out the year. The nice thing about the group is you meet other runners who run ultra marathons and, who are training for races like the Marathon Des Sables. It's more of training group with a wealth of knowledge.

    posted almost 3 years ago | Report

  • Liza A.
    Liza A. Sendmail
    in reply to what Paul S. said:Hey Tara, I'm with you on the 40 year old crisis as I am less than 2 months from that and probably part of the reason I did my 50 mile back in May. I quickly looked at higdon's calendar and honestly think the schedule I followed is better organi... read more

    Paul....this was a helpful site. I am thinking of doing my first 50 mile ultra run in 2010.....this schedule will be helpful.

    posted over 2 years ago | Report

  • Matt
    Matt Sendmail

    I just read through all the posts on here. Great information! Thanks to everyone for helping us beginners with good advice.

    posted over 2 years ago | Report

  • Jeff P.
    Jeff P. Sendmail

    I've been considering training for an ultra (probably 50 mile) in 2010.

    Can anyone suggest a good race that happens sometime in the Spring, preferably on the West Cost (either Canada or US)?

    Is there a comprehensive list of ultras anywhere online? Can't seem to find one..

    posted over 2 years ago | Report

  • Bill E.
    Bill E. Sendmail

    Jeff

    Here is a pretty good list of ultra's. http://www.coachweber.com/ultramarathoncalendar.htm

    If you want to try a 12 or 24 hour ultra format try this link http://www.geminiadventures.com/24hourstherun.html

    I am doing my first 50K on 24 Oct, the Goblin Valley Ultra in Utah.

    posted over 2 years ago | Report

  • Jeff P.
    Jeff P. Sendmail
    in reply to what Bill E. said:Jeff Here is a pretty good list of ultra's. http://www.coachweber.com/ultramarathoncalendar.htm If you want to try a 12 or 24 hour ultra format try this link http://www.geminiadventures.com/24hourstherun.html I am doing my first 50K on 24 Oct... read more

    Thanks Bill! I'll consider the Goblin Valley one too - I've been looking for an excuse to visit Utah.

    posted over 2 years ago | Report

  • Jonathan S.
    Jonathan S. Sendmail

    My thoughts on training - http://fellrnr.info/Essential-Ultrarunning-Tips

    posted about 2 years ago | Report

  • Delip R.
    Delip R. Sendmail
    in reply to what Jonathan S. said:My thoughts on training - http://fellrnr.info/Essential-Ultrarunning-Tips

    Great website Jonathan! Good stuff!!

    posted over 1 year ago | Report

  • Jonathan S.
    Jonathan S. Sendmail

    Thanks

    posted over 1 year ago | edited over 1 year ago | Report

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